Porsche Enthusiasts Club Forum

This car is for sale on a plot two miles away from me. I had a look at it yesterday and noticed it has Virgin911 number plates on it - and the headlights have condensation on the insides. Because it's on my route to the squash club I have seen that it has been there a while. The original price was £14995, now it's windscreen price is £13995. I got home and looked it up to see that it's on Autotrader for £11595. Therefore he's knocked £3400 off the windscreen price..... and he'll still make a profit.

Personal greed just annoys me - he deserves not to sell it.

http://www.greenwingmotors.co.uk/272970/used-cars.htm

It's the 1992 964 convertible that he says is a 'depreciation free stunner' - what about the £3400 he's knocked off!

For someone in Finance John you are remarkably naive. What margin do you think is acceptable?
Lets say he buys it for 10K so at 10% margin his retail would be 11,111 but he has to charge VAT on the profit which is 194.25 so the total is now 11,305.25. He will have had to valet it, possibly MOT it & maybe do a bit of rectification work say pads or tyres, maybe a bulb. If it needs a big service then could be 3-400 even for a trade quicky job,
If he's a half decent dealer he'll have what is known as a 60 day stocking loan which he will have to pay a rate on & will take a hammering on if he is out of bed on the 60 days, a bit like an over draft. Also under law he has to offer a minimum of 6 months warranty.
I suspect him & his family would like to eat occasionally so he needs some profit.
Finally this is a 964, the most expensive Porsche 911 of the group to service excluding turbos, has a slightly tarnished reliability record & when new would have been 45 or 50K (pure guess).

So you have to do all the above and have a game of Russian roulette, based on the fact that if it goes bang then an engine will be 4-5K fitted a gearbox 2k etc. How much profit do you want to be able to sleep well?
I suspect he bought it in at around 8-9K given the condition & his stocking loan has run out & he just wants shot of it. Also winter is coming & flogging cabs at that time of the year is like selling pork chops in a synagogue.

Me I wouldn't do it on a 944 which I know intimately no way on a 911!

This is a polite friendly reply - these forums and e-mails don't always convey emotions. I'm not offended by your posting Jim. Maybe I should have titled it better to show that it isn't actually 'mark-up' that I was annoyed at.

I'm not naive Jim - you don't get to our age and be naive (you're even older than me!) I'm honest, I'm not greedy, I don't rip people off, I don't churn business - don't move pensions or investments etc, and I don't charge fees. Being like must be a good thing as all the business I get comes from clients and referrals from clients - I have never ever advertised.

I accept he's got to make a profit, but when he can knock £3400 off and still make a profit it just shows a bit of greed. I guess that him and I are different types of people. I like to do things for clients so that I make a reasonable but not excessive profit - each to their own I suppose.

John,you missed the point! I don't reckon he is making a profit, probably a loss, especially if it needs repairs at the sellers cost in the 6 month warranty!
Have a look on AutoTrader, there are NO 964 cabs there for this money, most are around the 15-15K mark. As I intimated above I reckon stocking loan time is due & he just wants to move it on.
There is so much here to go wrong & kill the profit that I wouldn't want to be there. And I used to buy & sell cars as a part time basis in the 80's.

Did you have a guy called Terry helping you? Used to drive a Ford Capri?

Considering all the (interesting) information you have given, and today's economic climate, it sounds like it was a poor business decision on his part to buy it in the first place then. I'll tell you what Jim, I'll go and ask him what he paid for it and what needs doing to it - that's the easiest way to find out.

Yup I reckon he'll take a hit, be interested in the numbers.
Nope never had a sheepskin coat,normally the compulsory Ford or BMC rally Jacket of the time. We used to buy MOT failed family cars, like Maxis, Marinas & Minis & do whatever work was needed to get a legitimate ticket on them. So we'd buy at around 35-100 quid & punt them out for around the 350-500 quid mark. And before you laugh at the Maxi bit, we could sell everyone we got. Several times getting a knock at the door from someone asking for first refusal when we had finished it.
We were doing 1-3 cars a month between us, to the point where Colin & I who both worked in IT were asked by our respective managers if we'd mind doing a bit of work for the company rather than ourselves

Nope, not at all. I don't think John realised he was probably now selling at a loss.

Just kidding around Jim. From everything I've read thus far, sounds like it might be a good bargain for someone.

Ben

My thoughts indeed if I had the cash & a garage with space then I'd be interested.

Might be worth a punt! If someone got a full vehicle engineers report done to see if any nasties are on the horizon, you might be able to get the price down further. I know they're the more expensive 911 to run but could be a perfect weekend toy for someone.

Ben

No, no problems Ben. I wouldn't upset Jim as he's given me so much help in the past... and I've never even met him. My grievance was really about the windscreen price that somebody would pay not realising that it was advertised elsewhere for £2500 less - I think we'd all be peed-off if it happened to us.

It must be worth an offer of £10500 because he's got it advertised on Autotrader at £11495 - and you always advertise at more than you want.

The car actually looks very nice, Cobalt Blue with (off) white leather. The seats are as would be expected with such a mileage - showing cracks, but nothing serious. From some of the seats I've seen people restore on this forum they would look fantastic with a bit of TLC. The offside headlight had moisture inside it. The hood looks fine. I didn't take notice of tyres etc, but if somebody wants me to go and have a proper look over it, open bonnets and boots etc, and take a test drive for fun just to get some more info I can do.

I wouldn't be tempted because it's a C4 and not a C2. The '4' rather than '2' brings extra expense with it. My money this month is going on a new clutch, replacement seats from a low mileage 944 that will need recovering in grey leather, a new bonnet and a new off-side wing...... so plenty of layout there then Last month was road tax and new tyres . Next month it will be going in to have the sills done - or rather it's going in for a whole day to be investigated to see (or guess) how much needs doing, so more bills on the way. Never mind, the kids can do without Xmas presents..... got to get the priorities right

cant believe someone would winge so much about nothing,no one is making you buy the bloody car so stop whineing and get out more.

Yep. I'd be peed off too if I paid screen price then saw it on Autotrader cheaper. I quite like the '4'. I know it weighs 70kg more with the additional drive gear but it's quicker to 60 by 0.1s plus the added stability of 4 wheel drive. (Each to there own I know).

Ah well, if I was in the market for a 964 Cab at around £10k, I'd be having a look at that. But I don't so I won't.

Ben

What stability. The C2 is the best. How you can have a 911 with 4 wheel drive. Thats a Landrover. Porsche's aren't for use in snow. It's the way it feels when you drive it Ben.