Porsche Enthusiasts Club Forum :: View topic - Parts advice required, please.

Freinds. As you know if have a 1986 944 turbo. I bought it three weeks ago and i decided to take it to my local specialist Steve Bull Specialist cars in Devizes.

I asked him to carry out a basic service (oil, filters etc) change the coolant, change the brake fluid (i supplied ATE Blue), change the gearbox oil etc and carry out a few minor items that needed attention including a oil pressure sender and changing the bearings top and bottom of the drive shaft.
The bill currently stands at £835+vat (Gulp).

If possible I'd be willing to have a go at the brake fluid, basic service and oil pressure sender to be honest. If you were closer, I'd be willing to give you a hand (you never know, a local member to yourself may be willing...)

He has just phoned and told me that five remaining things need attention:

1) Clutch Flexi pipe leaking.
2) PAS Flexi pipe (high pressure) leaking. PM Dick Darstardly on Retro Rides. He runs his own PAS flexi pipe business. Say Chas sent you
3) Cam box gasket leaking oil onto the exhaust (apparently takes 1/2 day to fix?) Very cheap part, but apparently not the easiest thing to fit (but not the hardest either. Maybe another member can advise here
4) Gear box knuckle - I complianed that once a gear was selected the gear lever still moved an inch either side. When he says knuckle, does he mean the gear shift lever? This is something you could do in an hour tops IMO (maybe 2 with teabreaks) and they are £38 from Porsche with the circlips etc.
5) Ball joint worn (moving an inch) - apparently this is a coomon ailment of 944s. Hartech for a refurbed arm or Rennbay (balljoints) IMO. Again if you are feeling up to it, they are IME relatively simple to change on a 944 (around £200) from Hartech though). My only concern is that if it is really moving an inch Hartech may not take your lower arm back and it may not be possible to fit another balljoint into the arm (can they really move 1" whilst being safe? I changed mine when it barely moved 1-2mm!

He wants an additional £1000+vat for this work. So in total the bill would be £1835+vat <Ouchie>

Please can anyone advise on the parts that are needed for this work? Part numbers or companies that can supply / fit.
I havent got the additional £1k at the moment.

Cheers

Thanks All.

Chas - I PM'd Richard re the flexi.

I managed to find the A arms complete from a car that is to rusty to repair. The car they are from is a S2. Will these be the same as my turbo?

Are they all alloy?

Cheers
Rav

rav wrote:

The A Arms are the same on both. Same offsets etc so that will not be a proble, My only worry which I have said in the other thread is that since they have plastic caps, they may not last too long considering that your car is on 17" wheels.

But I guess anything is better than having 1" of play at the balljoint.

There are two types of Alloy arm yes. I believed that the difference between early arms and later arms was that the earlier arms had an offset of 20ish, hence why a number interim cars (between the 1985.1 and 1985.2) have had the earlier steel arms fitted onto them.

However, I could be wrong I admit.

I am fairly sure that I am not getting confused. Even on that parts page it lists two different arms for the 944, with the earlier arms being 'shorter' than the later arms due to the difference in offset on the wheels.

Sorry if I'm coming across as arrogant on this matter (and I'm possibly wrong anyway!):).

One of the 911&PW articles details the difference between early and late wishbones.

On the very of going back on myself, I *think* some of the crossover cars had the earlier arms, but the later wheels, hence they came with spacers fitted between the wheel and the hub to compensate. This would be pretty apparent though.

I have a 89 and an 86 that i broke the arms look the same to me.

Author:	rav [ Wed Sep 30, 2009 4:26 pm ]
Post subject:	Parts advice required, please.
Freinds. As you know if have a 1986 944 turbo. I bought it three weeks ago and i decided to take it to my local specialist Steve Bull Specialist cars in Devizes. I asked him to carry out a basic service (oil, filters etc) change the coolant, change the brake fluid (i supplied ATE Blue), change the gearbox oil etc and carry out a few minor items that needed attention including a oil pressure sender and changing the bearings top and bottom of the drive shaft. The bill currently stands at £835+vat (Gulp). He has just phoned and told me that five remaining things need attention: 1) Clutch Flexi pipe leaking. 2) PAS Flexi pipe (high pressure) leaking. 3) Cam box gasket leaking oil onto the exhaust (apparently takes 1/2 day to fix?) 4) Gear box knuckle - I complianed that once a gear was selected the gear lever still moved an inch either side. 5) Ball joint worn (moving an inch) - apparently this is a coomon ailment of 944s. He wants an additional £1000+vat for this work. So in total the bill would be £1835+vat <Ouchie> Please can anyone advise on the parts that are needed for this work? Part numbers or companies that can supply / fit. I havent got the additional £1k at the moment. Cheers

Author:	AlpineTurbo [ Wed Sep 30, 2009 4:52 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Parts advice required, please.
rav wrote: Freinds. As you know if have a 1986 944 turbo. I bought it three weeks ago and i decided to take it to my local specialist Steve Bull Specialist cars in Devizes. I asked him to carry out a basic service (oil, filters etc) change the coolant, change the brake fluid (i supplied ATE Blue), change the gearbox oil etc and carry out a few minor items that needed attention including a oil pressure sender and changing the bearings top and bottom of the drive shaft. The bill currently stands at £835+vat (Gulp). If possible I'd be willing to have a go at the brake fluid, basic service and oil pressure sender to be honest. If you were closer, I'd be willing to give you a hand (you never know, a local member to yourself may be willing...) He has just phoned and told me that five remaining things need attention: 1) Clutch Flexi pipe leaking. 2) PAS Flexi pipe (high pressure) leaking. PM Dick Darstardly on Retro Rides. He runs his own PAS flexi pipe business. Say Chas sent you 3) Cam box gasket leaking oil onto the exhaust (apparently takes 1/2 day to fix?) Very cheap part, but apparently not the easiest thing to fit (but not the hardest either. Maybe another member can advise here 4) Gear box knuckle - I complianed that once a gear was selected the gear lever still moved an inch either side. When he says knuckle, does he mean the gear shift lever? This is something you could do in an hour tops IMO (maybe 2 with teabreaks) and they are £38 from Porsche with the circlips etc. 5) Ball joint worn (moving an inch) - apparently this is a coomon ailment of 944s. Hartech for a refurbed arm or Rennbay (balljoints) IMO. Again if you are feeling up to it, they are IME relatively simple to change on a 944 (around £200) from Hartech though). My only concern is that if it is really moving an inch Hartech may not take your lower arm back and it may not be possible to fit another balljoint into the arm (can they really move 1" whilst being safe? I changed mine when it barely moved 1-2mm! He wants an additional £1000+vat for this work. So in total the bill would be £1835+vat <Ouchie> Please can anyone advise on the parts that are needed for this work? Part numbers or companies that can supply / fit. I havent got the additional £1k at the moment. Cheers The rest of the bits I would look at talking to Porsch-Apart, FraserPart, Bert Gear and OPC. If you cannot work on the car (time etc.) then fair enough. As for fitting, have you considered calling JMG as I don't think he is too far from you. Also try EMC Motorsport but he is quite a trek from you being on the North end of Central Birmingham.

Author:	tr7v8 [ Wed Sep 30, 2009 5:04 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Parts advice required, please.
Seems a bit steep TBH. All except the cambox gasket is fairly easy & that I'd leave until you have a belt change, unless it is pi..ing out. The belts need doing by someone who knows what they're doing. PS if the ball joint is the wishbone one & is moving an inch then the car needs grounding immediately. Any real wear here is an instant MOT failure & an inch would be very knackered indeed! Exchange wishbones from Hartech are around 200 quid exchange & easy to fit, although the geometry should be checked after.

Author:	J.J. [ Wed Sep 30, 2009 6:05 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Parts advice required, please.
Agree with Jim some of those prices are steep. Cam box gasket may need the top if the head skiming which means a head overhaul. Tolerance is just 3 thou. (You can't see that on a straight edge.) It shouldn't leak. You can get a cometic gasket that will cover a bigger tolerance from Lindsey racing for £20ish thats worth a try. Mines very bent & it lasted 12 months. It also has the advantage that it can't blow out so will only weep when it does start to leak. Check the front cam seal at the same time as that can look like cambox gasket if the leaks from the front corner near the oil filter. If you just change the gasket dont be surprised if it starts to leak. (Half a day? Even if the threads striped out it wouldn't take that long.)

Author:	rav [ Wed Sep 30, 2009 6:53 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Parts advice required, please.
Thanks All. Chas - I PM'd Richard re the flexi. I managed to find the A arms complete from a car that is to rusty to repair. The car they are from is a S2. Will these be the same as my turbo? Are they all alloy? Cheers Rav

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Author:	mikec [ Wed Sep 30, 2009 7:36 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Parts advice required, please.
Hi Rav. When I got my S2 it had a knackered ball joint. Needs the whole the control arm replaced. I got a good used one off of ebay for £40 and saved myself a good few hundred bucks in parts. There is usually loads of these on ebay although you take a bit of a risk using a used part. It is a half hour job to change these so worth the risk in my opinion. I will happly look up the ebay supplier I used if you want it. I think they are actively scrapping 944s and selling on ebay. I will almost bet it is the front right ball joint that is gone? I read somewhere that the power stearing leaks onto it an rots the rubber. Hope you get you stuff sorted with not too much £££. Mike Edit: Think you got one already!

Author:	AlpineTurbo [ Wed Sep 30, 2009 8:57 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Parts advice required, please.
rav wrote: Thanks All. Chas - I PM'd Richard re the flexi. I managed to find the A arms complete from a car that is to rusty to repair. The car they are from is a S2. Will these be the same as my turbo? Are they all alloy? Cheers Rav The A Arms are the same on both. Same offsets etc so that will not be a proble, My only worry which I have said in the other thread is that since they have plastic caps, they may not last too long considering that your car is on 17" wheels. But I guess anything is better than having 1" of play at the balljoint.

Author:	Richy_S [ Wed Sep 30, 2009 9:39 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Parts advice required, please.
FortyFourSuperTwo wrote: rav wrote: Thanks All. Chas - I PM'd Richard re the flexi. I managed to find the A arms complete from a car that is to rusty to repair. The car they are from is a S2. Will these be the same as my turbo? Are they all alloy? Cheers Rav The A Arms are the same on both. Same offsets etc so that will not be a proble, My only worry which I have said in the other thread is that since they have plastic caps, they may not last too long considering that your car is on 17" wheels. But I guess anything is better than having 1" of play at the balljoint. Are you sure? I though early Turbo arms were different. There are definately 2 types of alloy arm - check part nos Rav. What are the plastic caps you refer to? Rich

Author:	AlpineTurbo [ Wed Sep 30, 2009 10:00 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Parts advice required, please.
There are two types of Alloy arm yes. I believed that the difference between early arms and later arms was that the earlier arms had an offset of 20ish, hence why a number interim cars (between the 1985.1 and 1985.2) have had the earlier steel arms fitted onto them. However, I could be wrong I admit. The plastic caps I am referring to are what go in between the physical balljoint itself and the arm. From when I have read and heard from the suppliers, they suggested that the plastic bushing is what fails and what intially causes the play, and given time if left unattended is what can render the arm scrap (i.e when the balljoint starts rubbing on the alloy of the wishbone itself). The cap/bushing can be seen the intermediate steps of this Rennbay balljoint installation article: http://www.rennbay.com/info_pages.php?pages_id=13

Author:	Richy_S [ Wed Sep 30, 2009 10:06 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Parts advice required, please.
FortyFourSuperTwo wrote: There are two types of Alloy arm yes. I believed that the difference between early arms and later arms was that the earlier arms had an offset of 20ish, hence why a number interim cars (between the 1985.1 and 1985.2) have had the earlier steel arms fitted onto them. However, I could be wrong I admit. Alloy arms - offset???? Are you getting confused with wheels? http://www.hartech.org/parts.html Rich

Author:	AlpineTurbo [ Wed Sep 30, 2009 10:14 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Parts advice required, please.
Sorry, you are right. I worded that badly (that above post was a combination of talking and typing ) Anyway, now I am free... Even on that parts page it lists two different arms for the 944, with the earlier arms being 'shorter' than the later arms due to the difference in offset on the wheels. Sorry if I'm coming across as arrogant on this matter (and I'm possibly wrong anyway!):). One of the 911&PW articles details the difference between early and late wishbones. On the very of going back on myself, I think some of the crossover cars had the earlier arms, but the later wheels, hence they came with spacers fitted between the wheel and the hub to compensate. This would be pretty apparent though.

Author:	tr7v8 [ Wed Sep 30, 2009 10:38 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Parts advice required, please.
FortyFourSuperTwo wrote: I am fairly sure that I am not getting confused. Even on that parts page it lists two different arms for the 944, with the earlier arms being 'shorter' than the later arms due to the difference in offset on the wheels. Sorry if I'm coming across as arrogant on this matter (and I'm possibly wrong anyway!):). One of the 911&PW articles details the difference between early and late wishbones. On the very of going back on myself, I think some of the crossover cars had the earlier arms, but the later wheels, hence they came with spacers fitted between the wheel and the hub to compensate. This would be pretty apparent though. Yup Baz lists 2 arms for a 944 http://www.hartech.org/parts.html for the middle & late 944s.

Author:	timboukvw [ Thu Oct 01, 2009 12:00 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Parts advice required, please.
I have a 89 and an 86 that i broke the arms look the same to me.

Author:	944 Man [ Thu Oct 01, 2009 3:42 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Parts advice required, please.
Model year 86 aluminium wishbones are different. 87, 88, 89, 90 & 91 parts are all the same (and will all have a 951 prefixed part number). 968 parts are essentially the same, but they have an improved balljoint and a 944 prefixed part number. In order to tell whether your '1986' Turbo is a 1986 or a 1987 model year youll need to look at the original wheels: 23mm offset = MY86 and 52.3mm offset = MY87. Make sure that you dont have an pre-ABS offset car with later 52.3mm ABS offset wheels and spacers though: hence 'oriiginal' wheels... Simon

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Author:	944 Man [ Thu Oct 01, 2009 3:45 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Parts advice required, please.
timboukvw wrote: I have a 89 and an 86 that i broke the arms look the same to me. Further to my post above: if this is the case then you have a 1987 model year944 which was built towards the end of 1986. A 1986 model year 944 will have been built between September 1985 and August 1986. A 944 built during September 1986 will be a 1987 model 944.