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| 944 2.5 CAN I PUT A 2.7 ENGINE IN? https://forums.tipec.net/viewtopic.php?f=25&t=12923 |
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| Author: | bjporsche [ Sun May 06, 2012 7:29 pm ] |
| Post subject: | 944 2.5 CAN I PUT A 2.7 ENGINE IN? |
I HAVE A 1982 944, 2.5 8V MANUAL HOW EASY WOULD IT BE TO PUT A 2.7 8V ENGINE IN THE CAR. ? THE 2.7 ENGINE WAS FROM AN AUTO 944 F REG . IM NOT CHANGING TO AN AUTO BOX, BUT I WOULD LIKE TO FIT THE 2.7 ENGINE AS IT IS ALOT LESS MILES THEN THE 2.5 ENGINE THAT I HAVE. THANKYOU FOR ANY HELP / ADVISE. |
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| Author: | flt505 [ Sun May 06, 2012 11:26 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 944 2.5 CAN I PUT A 2.7 ENGINE IN? |
I think the swop should be easy, but the 2.7 is a multi valve twin configuration, similar to the later S2 engine wise. Make sure you get the engine wiring loom, as this will be different to the 2.5. Not a fundie on your project & am sure others here will give more radical comments/advice... Dave |
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| Author: | lindsayhbrown [ Sun May 06, 2012 11:28 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 944 2.5 CAN I PUT A 2.7 ENGINE IN? |
Shouldn't be too difficult, will require engine loom and ecu, both are 8v |
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| Author: | tr7v8 [ Mon May 07, 2012 10:07 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 944 2.5 CAN I PUT A 2.7 ENGINE IN? |
Really a question for Jon Mitchell but pretty sure the looms are the same, the engine will run on a late 2.5 ECU I know we've done it. Not sure what the driveability will be like as obviously the mapping will be slightly different. You'll need the flywheel etc off of the 2.5. |
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| Author: | eurocliff [ Mon May 07, 2012 10:12 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 944 2.5 CAN I PUT A 2.7 ENGINE IN? |
I have a 2.7 ECU up for grabs if you're interested. |
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| Author: | pauly [ Mon May 07, 2012 10:42 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 944 2.5 CAN I PUT A 2.7 ENGINE IN? |
flt505 wrote: I think the swop should be easy, but the 2.7 is a multi valve twin configuration, similar to the later S2 engine wise. am sure others here will give more radical comments/advice... Dave First bit of advice I'll give is the 2.7 engine is 8 valve not 16 like the S2.......  .
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| Author: | jmgarage [ Mon May 07, 2012 11:55 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 944 2.5 CAN I PUT A 2.7 ENGINE IN? |
We have done a lot of this kind of thing, swapping engines between early 944's, late 944's, 944 S2's, 944 Turbo's, 968's and hybrid (2.8, 3.0 and 3.2) turbo engines into all these models. Each has their own challenges and problems. My recent favourite was putting an S2 3.0 16 valve engine into a pre 85 944 lux, which with the slightly lower gearing and lighter weight of the early 944, combined with a chip, induction kit and a free flowing exhaust, made be an excellent car to drive. I am even contemplating doing another one with an early 944 I have as a trackday trainer for the lads in the workshop. You have been given good advice so far, the 2.7 engine you have in mind is a 8 valve engine. Because you mentioned it was an 88, I did suspect it was maybe a 2.5 16v S engine you had in mind, but they did not make those in automatic configuration as far as I know, so lets just assume it is the 2.7 8v engine. I would recommend you get the engine complete with ECU, engine loom, exhaust and intake manifolds all in one bundle. If the engine has power steering, get it complete with the power steering pump (makes an easy conversion to power steering if you want that) and get it with the alternator and all the tensioner rods for the alternator and power steering pump. You might not need the loom, but it is handy to have, even if it is a reference of where each connector goes if you get in a pickle, or if your old loom has connectors falling apart when you disturb it. Take out your 2.5 engine, complete with bell housing and engine loom (disconnect it inside the car and pass it through the bulkhead. From memory, the flywheels of the manual 2.5 and 2.7 lux are the same, so I would recommend putting your flywheel and a nice new clutch onto the 2.7 engine before you fit it. Also use a couple of new crank sensors, this way you can adjust them out of the car before you fit it and old ones rarely survive the disturbance. It may be easier at this point to swap your old loom onto the new engine. The later cars have a different loom, but the only problem with the later loom is how it connects into the fuse box and dashboard wiring for instruments. We have retrofitted the later looms and it is not rocket science, even though the ecu sits in a different place, everything still reaches ecu wise on the later loom, you just have some fun with tieing it into the earlier cars fusebox and instrument wiring. If you love your car, and are going to keep it, I would really recommend giving the 2.7 engine new gaskets, oil seals, water pump, tensioners, rollers and belts before it goes in, as this could mean that the engine is good for years without hassle. Installing the engine will be just as easy as installing a standard engine. You will need to use either the 2.7 Ecu or a 87 to 88 2.5 ecu with a 2.7 chip Other than that it is plain sailing really. You will gain some torque and a little power as well as a newer engine while your engine bay will continue to look completely standard. If you need any advice as your doing it, or if you need any parts, give us a call, either myself or Mark will be able to advise you as we have both done a lot of this kind of thing at JMG. |
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| Author: | tr7v8 [ Mon May 07, 2012 11:58 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 944 2.5 CAN I PUT A 2.7 ENGINE IN? |
pauly wrote: flt505 wrote: I think the swop should be easy, but the 2.7 is a multi valve twin configuration, similar to the later S2 engine wise. am sure others here will give more radical comments/advice... Dave First bit of advice I'll give is the 2.7 engine is 8 valve not 16 like the S2....... .Err Lindsay corrected that a few posts ago. Electronically the engines are identical. Certainly we plugged a 89 2.7 NA ECU into a 87 2.5 & it started & ran. SO the sensors & wiring is all identical. |
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| Author: | pauly [ Mon May 07, 2012 12:27 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 944 2.5 CAN I PUT A 2.7 ENGINE IN? |
tr7v8 wrote: Electronically the engines are identical. Certainly we plugged a 89 2.7 NA ECU into a 87 2.5 & it started & ran. SO the sensors & wiring is all identical. Are you sure an 82 and an 89 will be compatible ?. |
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| Author: | tr7v8 [ Mon May 07, 2012 12:35 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 944 2.5 CAN I PUT A 2.7 ENGINE IN? |
pauly wrote: tr7v8 wrote: Electronically the engines are identical. Certainly we plugged a 89 2.7 NA ECU into a 87 2.5 & it started & ran. SO the sensors & wiring is all identical. Are you sure an 82 and an 89 will be compatible ?. Possibly not I hadn't seen that it was an earlier engine, there were myriad changes pre & post face lift. DME types changed as well. But 2.7 stuff is fairly rare so the ability to use late 2.5 stuff will be good. As Jon says use the whole loom, ECU etc. will make it easier. |
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| Author: | lindsayhbrown [ Mon May 07, 2012 7:03 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 944 2.5 CAN I PUT A 2.7 ENGINE IN? |
The only reason I mentioned changing the ecu was I recently read somewhere that fitting the 2.7 ecu to a 2.5 caused extremely high emmisions |
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| Author: | tr7v8 [ Mon May 07, 2012 7:20 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 944 2.5 CAN I PUT A 2.7 ENGINE IN? |
lindsayhbrown wrote: The only reason I mentioned changing the ecu was I recently read somewhere that fitting the 2.7 ecu to a 2.5 caused extremely high emmisions Yup the 2.7 will presumably overfuel a 2.5 when fitted. But the 2.7 will need that extra fuel to run properly. |
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| Author: | jmgarage [ Mon May 07, 2012 7:24 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 944 2.5 CAN I PUT A 2.7 ENGINE IN? |
ECU or at least the ECU chip will need to be changed, otherwise you will end up with something that you may get running ok by playing with the airflow meter and air bypass, but it will never run right in all rpm and load conditions. Basicly, its much easier to just use the 2.7 ecu as it will work right out of the box. You can adapt a 86 ecu and a 2.7 chip, or you can use a post 87 ecu with a 2.7 chip, but its easier to just use the 2.7 ecu as is. |
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| Author: | J.J. [ Mon May 07, 2012 8:05 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 944 2.5 CAN I PUT A 2.7 ENGINE IN? |
One thing. Some parts for the 2.7 are harder to find & more expensive. Notably inlet valves & water pumps! Though most bits are the same. |
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| Author: | pauly [ Mon May 07, 2012 9:21 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 944 2.5 CAN I PUT A 2.7 ENGINE IN? |
J.J. wrote: One thing. Some parts for the 2.7 are harder to find & more expensive. Notably inlet valves & water pumps! Though most bits are the same. Isn't the 2.7 waterpump the same as an S2, anyway the 2.7 engine isn't worth much, I'll do the OP a favour and take it away for £100  .
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